I am going to make a series of posts on the Yu-Gi-Oh! Forbidden List. It was released about a week ago so every player should have had the chance to take a look at www.yugioh-card.com. Part One will focus on an analysis of the overall list and the newly Forbidden cards.
Let’s just get this out in the open. There are two indisputable facts of life in this wonderful game we all play and love. First, there is no such thing as a perfect ban list. Second, there is no player or committee of players in the world that can have the required quantities of skill, foresight, and lack of bias to even affirm a list’s perfection (if such a list hypothetically existed).
Long story short: instead of nit-picking a list’s deficiencies, we should simply classify lists as great, good, bad, or terrible for overall game health and balance.
So How Did Konami Do?
For all intents and purposes this is an amazing ban list. For this iteration, I can only find a few cards and decisions that I dislike on the actual list itself (my issues with the list will come in a future post). And while there are a handful of cards I would have liked to see adjusted that weren’t, such situations are few and far between.
Part Two in this series will discuss the newly limited and semi-limited cards. Part Three will talk about my issues with the list and what I feel Konami should have done differently.
For ease of reading, I have just jotted down a few notes card by card to explain Konami’s reasoning through an experienced player’s perspective, and why each decision was correct in my estimation.
Forbidden Cards:
Dark Strike Fighter- Nobody disputes this card. Dark Strike Fighter actually joins a club of only two other members. The club is “cards that deal significant life point damage without losing card advantage.” And prior to DSF’s release, the only two members were Chaos Emperor Dragon and Ring of Destruction. These two cards, as everyone knows, are some of the best cards ever made in the game. Ring is basically a staple in every deck and one of the best three traps ever printed (Imperial Order/Sixth Sense being the others). CED is one of the best three monsters ever printed.
DSF was less potent than Ring and CED in card power but had the unique property of being an Extra Deck monster. This meant the rapid swarm of special summoning let players toolbox it out without having to devote main-deck space to drawing it! And because DSF dealt more non-battle damage than CED, Ring, or any other card in the game, it created a huge problem. Konami had already decreed through the banning of Ring/CED that games should end due to attacks (or alternate win conditions), not random burn effects that lose no card advantage.
I think the burn effects of Thestalos and Caius are the absolute upper limit of what the game should tolerate in terms of those type of burn effects. Kudos to Konami for taking a slight hit to Crimson Crisis to address the biggest problem in the game. This next format will be incredibly slow.
Crush Card Virus- Crush Card Virus is one of the most overrated cards in recent history. I can recall multiple times where Jason Grabher-Meyer (the best Yu-Gi-Oh! coverage man in the business) wrote “X duelist set a monster and Crush Card Virus, this one is over.” And then the person revolved CCV, hit nothing, and actually lost!
Yet CCV is still rather unbalanced, despite its overrated stature. It is a card that can single-handedly win a duel and (more importantly) governs what types of monsters competitive players can play. Blocking off 50% of the playable monster pool is never a good idea. I will emphasize this over and over in this blog; good design involves letting players have choices and options. You only need look at the turnout for Nationals in this diverse format to see the power of choice.
CCV, as opposed to its cousin DDV (Deck Devastation Virus), is broken because the monster used to trigger it is almost always a floater. Sangan, flipped monsters like Night Assailant and Old Vindictive Magician, Necro Gardna, Spirit Reaper, and Plaguespreader Zombie often make CCV’s hard cost of “two cards” actually one. So that even if it hits nothing, it’s worth using just for the two draw phases and hand information alone!
With 2 Chaos Sorcerer running amok now, and the standard Caius and Dark Armed Dragon, it will be interesting to keep an eye on DDV and see if it has an impact on this environment. Anytime decks skew too much toward lower ATK tech monsters, DDV decks can shoot to the top tier.
Monster Reborn/Call of the Haunted- Over the past lists, we have now cycled through Premature Burial, Monster Reborn, and now Call of the Haunted. Since all three cards deal with special summoning from the graveyard, it’s interesting to determine which (if any) of the cards are balanced for the game.
Premature Burial has far too many broken interactions with certain cards (Giant Trunade, Power Tool Dragon, Arms Hole) to stay. Monster Reborn has no cost and no “attachment” like Call and Premature (continuous trap and equip spell). While Reborn provides the benefit of forcing players to manage their own graveyards, that slight gain does not make up for the increased speed and luck it adds to the game.
Process of elimination leaves Call of the Haunted. CoTH is an amazingly well balanced card. It takes a turn to set up, forcing players to plan ahead without the ability to simply play a spell and flood through additional damage. Yet CoTH adds many nuances to the game that promote skill.
CoTH rewards deck-builders who choose cards such as Jinzo, Cyber Phoenix, and Goblin Zombie for their builds. Chaining CoTH in these cases to certain effects will fizzle the opponent’s card, creating advantage through sheer skill and card choices. I still recall the first time someone told me players could chain CoTH to Jinzo, negating a trap. It was amazing!
CoTH effectively sets up situations for players to generate advantage gains while having the drawback of being -1′ed by cards such as Breaker, Celestia, and Monarchs. This adds another chess piece to the board to create more elaborate, involving duels in my opinion. Great job to Konami for recognizing this and bringing it back!
Card of Safe Return: This is a pretty simple ban. Any time a card can generate a legitimate +5 in a realistic scenario, it should go.
Related posts:
I’m rather amazed that Breaker, D.D. Warrior Lady, and Greeb Baboon are all at 3! What happend to Breaker?
So far I like this list a lot. While there is always an initial shock when a new list hits the streets it’s always a great chance to step back and evaluate cards and archetypes to see what can be successful in the new metagame. I don’t have issues with any of these cards getting banned.
I’m really looking forward to the next Shonen Jump to see what players are bringing to the tables and what new ideas Lightsworn, Gladiator Beast and Blackwing players are going to try and implement.
I have to disagree on dsf being able to deal damage without losing card advantage
Dsf equals mass driver, cannon soldier, and catapult turtle in terms of advatage, but the amount of damage it dealt surpasses any of its counterparts. At 200 damage per level, dsf can deal significant damage after its tribute monsters dealt their own damage via attacks. With such an effect added on an easily summoned synchro monster, u got one broken monster that ended half of the duels since it was released.
I think this IS the best balanced list we have seen thus far.
I happen to agree with the Banned and Limited cards, but I don’t quite understand the reason for bringing, as already said, Breaker/D.D WL/Fissure to 3…
-Don’t Spellcaster decks get a good boost from getting Breaker back to three?
-Monster removal is a whole lot easier with DDWL at 3 now (removed from play his difficult to retrieve monsters from).
-People might start replacing Lightning Vortex for a few Fissures now..
RE: Call of the Haunted.
It’s actually kinda interesting.
Playing with Call again, I’ve realized one thing: it’s status as a trap gives it very desireable abilities not had by the other two recursion cards.
First is the ability to save your life. Only call has the ability to put a sizeable body(if it exists in the ‘yard, of course) in front of the monster(s) that would normally be your death knell. Both Gorz and Tragoedia require you to take a hit and then allow you to stop the proverbial bleeding. And even then, you have to analyze the best time to drop(not a problem) AND hope your opponent attacks in the way you need him/her too. Neither of these is a problem for good ol CotH.
Secondly, and perhaps most importantly, is Call’s surprise factor on the offensive end. With the other two, you have to assemble your army, attack into the opponent’s defenses, then hope for the best. Call allows you to somewhat dance and maneuver around these defenses. Don’t be surprised if you see lots of games this format ending in the same battle phase that someone catches Mirror Force for -2.
This banlist is very very intriguing indeed. COTH is back which makes games very very interesting. The banlist as a whole is awesome! Heck gadgets may make a big comeback due to the unlimiting of fissure and DDWL and Breaker! Chaos Sorcerer being at 2 is like wow! But hey cheers to konami for making a very balanced ban list!!
Great blog, always love reading your stuff!!
I also agree with the new limited and banned cards, this new format will make players think outside the box and rewards the skilled player smore than those who have enough money to netdeck a deck and be lucky enough to pull a DSF OTK.
The only card I disagree with you on is Call of the Haunted.
You talk about it as if generic revival is somehow balanced and necessary to the game. It isn’t. Cards like this (that have only become more powerful since synchros were released) are bad for the game because they allow for lucky top decks, and because they hurt creative deck builders.
As long as cards like CotH and Brain Control exist, players will only be able to build 38 card decks. The other 2 slots will always be filled by CotH and Brain Control.
I would rather we had CCV than CotH.
IMO Testarosu’s burn effect is a bit weak, despite coming free… Should be a bit stronger, like 150 per level…
Gaius’s burn effect is a bit TOO good, but tolerable…
Israel had its first Regional Event for the Advanced Format this past weeks. Lightsworn is too difficult to confront… A matchup against Lightsworn meant to many of the top players in here a negative bye…
RE: Dark Strike Fighter
Since when does Tributing monsters not equal losing card advantage?
Why Breaker at 3.
Breaker at 3 really does help balance this format. LS, BW and GB don’t really have space for 3 Breakers so you won’t see too many of these decks running Breaker in 3s and still be effective. Breaker is a splashable card at 1 but beyond that if your not runing a spellcounter type deck or Dark Variant it can be a dead draw in those 3 decks.
DSF: Isn’t it obvious?
When you launch cards to DSF, it’s either stuff you’ll lose anyways (Rescue Catted Airbellums) or game. When you “lose cards” to deal game ending damage, it’s not a loss of card advantage.
Droo: I think you’re overestimating COTH. It’s definitely not a main-deck staple.
I agree with all of Konami’s latest bans. This part of the list was inarguably done correctly in terms of what it did, as opposed to what it missed. I don’t think the game needs a generic revivial card, so I was opposed to bringing back Call, but Reborn/DSF/CCV/CoSR are all easily banworthy.
@ “When you launch cards to DSF, it’s either stuff you’ll lose anyways (Rescue Catted Airbellums) or game. When you “lose cards” to deal game ending damage, it’s not a loss of card advantage.”
Exactly. Most of the time, it’s simply game. That doesn’t mean you don’t lose advantage, though. It simply means that the advantage loss doesn’t matter because you win the game anyway. And THAT is the problem with DSF.
In cases where that you won’t win with DSF, it actually requires skill to decide whether or not you’ll launch your monsters, and just how many. Given, in such a case, you wouldn’t go for DSF anyway.
Also, let’s take a broader look on the Airbellum case. You don’t launch them because you would lose them in the End Phase, you go for launchable Airbellums that would otherwise be lost BECAUSE you can launch them. In other cases, one would probably go for 1 Airbellum and a non-Tuner for a LV6- Synchro. In the end, you still lost advantage.
The only downer about having DSF banned is that there really aren’t any non-specific LV7 Synchros to play now that also don’t half-require you to build your deck a certain way (like Power Tool being so weak it NEEDS the equip support, and Ancient Fairy being just a wall that can take down opposing GB’s ‘Ancient Forest’ and also ‘Zombie World’ to guard against EBGs that can attack regardless of her being a wall).
I just want the DT cards so bad…. T_T
Call of the Haunted ain’t in my deck… I’m workin’ with Diamond Dude (Destiny Draw at 3) and Phantom of Chaos, and Call doesn’t find space because it’s not a normal spell. Now it’s true that my deck is not teir 1… I’m just giving an example of a deck that decides to opt out on CotH. AND Brain Control actually, though I should probably put it in…
I think that they shouldn’t have limited BW-Gale of the Whirlwind. He’s good at two. And also, Demise didn’t have to be limited because DSF was banned. Otherwise the list is perfect.
Demise seems to keep popping up in OTK combos each format, so limiting him to the point you need Manju to grab him helps limit his viability, at least.
While CoTH is a revival card, you cant use it the turn you topdeck it. Also if it is destroyed you lose the monsters, so you would still need to activate it in your opponents turn to bring a monster if you plan to survive. CoTH can be used in many ways that Monster Reborn or Premature Burial couldnt, but those 2 are far more broken, and in this slower format skilled players can do great, and CoTH aids that.
Examples of disadvantages of CoTH are:
*You cant tribute the special summoned monsters in that turn you topdecked it, since its a trap.
*Your opponent has 1 more turn to draw something to prevent it. (Mystical, heavy storm)
*Correct me if Im wrong but if CoTH is there and Giant Trunade activates, monster dies right?
There are far more reasons why this card has disadvantages, but this doesnt means it HAS its advantages. My point is that the decision to bring it back, especially in this format, it was great.
Also, at the Airbellum discussion, I understand the fact that you go for Airbellums that will die in the end phase because you can launch them, but you dont go for them because you can launch them, you go for them because you can attack and use thei refect, then synchro OR launch them making yourself be in a far better position than any other move you could’ve done. Apologies if I misunderstood the Airbellum conversation.
HUH?
What’s so hard to believe?
yata garasu and harpies futhers dust should come and dark m of chos should come back becuse they have been gone for a long time plesse bring them back just for limted list
ok whats the point of making cards if u cant use them
@cris:
They were limited long enough for us to know that having them legal at all reduces skill in the game.
There is no point in making cards that can’t be used, but these cards were designed at a time when, while being quite imbalanced already, the game wasn’t being won or lost upon their activation/summon.
As far as specifics goes –
Yata Garasu is too powerful with a certain Sky Scourge and Phantom of Chaos existing. Possibly even moreso than it was with CED-EotE.
Harpie’s Feather Duster is a skill-less Heavy Storm.
DMOC can never be legal again. D.D.R. and Zombie World abuse see to that.
Amazing! Not clear for me, how offen you updating your go-ygo.com.
SonyaSunny
I have already seen it somethere…
Robor
Ugh, I liked! So clear and positively.
dsf is broken.but i hope that dark magiction of chaos come back to limited as almost all broken spell cards are banned.one-for-one should be banned.broken
in my opionion,
y dsf is banned:
1)does not require specific synchro material.
2)its effect can be used unlimited time per turn.
3)can combo with demise which can lead to OTK
dsf itself can deal 4000 point of dmg it is overpowered so it is banworthty.
but for me. i think tat is no reason to banned dark magiction of chaos.
1)almost all broken spell is banned.
2)can’t combo with MONSTER REBORN or DIMENSION FUSION as both of them are being banned.
y breaker is unlimited now?
then if every deck got 3 breaker gonna be wtf!
i think psychic deck no longer overpower becos of mind master is restricted so as 1-for-1.i suggest that konami should ban 1-for-1.it is still broken even each deck at 1.
judgment dragon should be limited and brionac and pot of greed
while cyber dragon should be allowed so ppl can summon cyber end dragon easier
RE:matt
to be able to say that pot of greed should be at one with a straight face shows something about how bad you are. People have argued reasonably that it is the best card in the game ever. Allure of Darkness and Destiny Draw were supposed to be pots with a drawback and both drove the teledad format and were both semi-limited.